how much HP do these usually add?
#51
08-20-2009, 09:07 PM
what he's trying/pretty much saying is...in other words he doesnt think you understand how much 400 hp is for a street car....you dont need to push it you'll be fine with that much
#52
08-20-2009, 09:48 PM
ok well then you guys are really gonna think im crazy!! lol
because the rules have changed and i no longer am gonna use my camaro as my daily driver so it doesn't matter about gas mileage anymore
so im gonna get the 500hp 383
ohhhh yeah!
im not sure which set up to go with:
either tunnel ram with dual quad carbs like camaro69
or just the air gap intake that comes with the engine and a double pumper carb
or just the dual carb intake with dual quad carbs
which option do you think would give me the most HP and TQ gain?
because the rules have changed and i no longer am gonna use my camaro as my daily driver so it doesn't matter about gas mileage anymore
so im gonna get the 500hp 383
ohhhh yeah! im not sure which set up to go with:
either tunnel ram with dual quad carbs like camaro69
or just the air gap intake that comes with the engine and a double pumper carb
or just the dual carb intake with dual quad carbs
which option do you think would give me the most HP and TQ gain?
#53
08-21-2009, 12:34 AM
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The 'Burbs of Chicago
Posts: 18,306
Here's what I came up with. Unfortunately, Patriot Performance isn't very revealing about the specifics of the components they use to get to 500 horsies. So plugging specific engine data into Desktop Dyno was kinda hit & miss. I was able to give a "best guess" estimate of what they might be running. With that, I was able to establish a baseline estimate of 498 hp @ 6k rpm and 481 lb of torque @ 4500 rpm, which is damn close to their claim.
Then swapping to a tunnel ram with dual 450 carbs (600's would be overkill) gave you 554 hp @ 6k rpm and 526 torque @ 4500 rpm.
For comparison sake, the tunnel ram showed 435 hp @ 4500 rpm, and the air-gap manifold with a single 750 carb gave 412 hp @ 4500 rpm. You can see how the tunnel ram builds more hp at the higher rpm range than the air-gap does.
DD doesn't have an option for me to put in a lower profile dual quad setup, but obviously it would fall somewhere between the two. In my estimation, probably closer to the air-gap side than the tunnel ram.
So which way to go? It's up to you. Do you want stuff sticking out of the hood or not? Would you ever be leaving your car unattended for a period of time? You sure would hate for some scum bag to take your carbs off your hands when you're not looking.
The engine itself makes plenty of torque, so I can tell you a tunnel ram doesn't make it unstreetable and doggy in the lower rpm's like some may think. If you're ever in IL, I can show you how it feels to have your eyeballs push against your brain!
But you will have to tinker a bit to get it to perform correctly. Right now, my eventual plan is to go with a cross ram dual quad intake when I get tired of the tunnel ram. I still like the wow factor, but my carbs will be coming down closer to earth when I'm ready to give the car a makeover.
Then swapping to a tunnel ram with dual 450 carbs (600's would be overkill) gave you 554 hp @ 6k rpm and 526 torque @ 4500 rpm.
For comparison sake, the tunnel ram showed 435 hp @ 4500 rpm, and the air-gap manifold with a single 750 carb gave 412 hp @ 4500 rpm. You can see how the tunnel ram builds more hp at the higher rpm range than the air-gap does.
DD doesn't have an option for me to put in a lower profile dual quad setup, but obviously it would fall somewhere between the two. In my estimation, probably closer to the air-gap side than the tunnel ram.
So which way to go? It's up to you. Do you want stuff sticking out of the hood or not? Would you ever be leaving your car unattended for a period of time? You sure would hate for some scum bag to take your carbs off your hands when you're not looking.
The engine itself makes plenty of torque, so I can tell you a tunnel ram doesn't make it unstreetable and doggy in the lower rpm's like some may think. If you're ever in IL, I can show you how it feels to have your eyeballs push against your brain!
But you will have to tinker a bit to get it to perform correctly. Right now, my eventual plan is to go with a cross ram dual quad intake when I get tired of the tunnel ram. I still like the wow factor, but my carbs will be coming down closer to earth when I'm ready to give the car a makeover.
Last edited by Camaro 69; 08-21-2009 at 12:37 AM.
#54
08-21-2009, 12:50 AM
ok thanks alot camaro
so how much HP/TQ do you think the dual quads would make at the peak rpm?
well i wouldn't leave it unattended for too long..i might just cruise around with it and if i park somewhere just stay around the car or have someone else with me to watch it..
i dont know which to pick..tunnel ram or just dual quads..
so how much HP/TQ do you think the dual quads would make at the peak rpm?
well i wouldn't leave it unattended for too long..i might just cruise around with it and if i park somewhere just stay around the car or have someone else with me to watch it..
i dont know which to pick..tunnel ram or just dual quads..
#55
08-21-2009, 01:18 AM
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The 'Burbs of Chicago
Posts: 18,306
If you want to go duals, Edelbrock makes an air-gap dual quad version.
I'd have to guess maybe in the 520 hp range @ 6k, and prolly in the upper 400's for tq.
There's only one thing I don't like about the tunnel ram, and that's a lack of security. If we're out with the car, say at a cruise night, then want to go out to eat at a restaurant or maybe see a movie, I'll take the car back home and go back out with the "normal" car. It can be a big inconvenience. For some reason, the car does attract attention, but I don't want to attract the wrong kind of attention. I wouldn't be able to sit through a movie thinking the car is sitting outside stripped to the frame. I know that sounds cynical, but there are people out there who like to take things that don't belong to them. I don't have the luxury of slamming the hood closed to secure the engine up. If I had a hood on, the carbs would still be sticking through it. The carbs, air cleaner, and other misc stuff would still be exposed and could be removed. So, since I don't plan on leaving it unattended, I don't bother covering it all up with a hood.
For those reasons, I would think long and hard about going with a tunnel ram.
I'd have to guess maybe in the 520 hp range @ 6k, and prolly in the upper 400's for tq.
There's only one thing I don't like about the tunnel ram, and that's a lack of security. If we're out with the car, say at a cruise night, then want to go out to eat at a restaurant or maybe see a movie, I'll take the car back home and go back out with the "normal" car. It can be a big inconvenience. For some reason, the car does attract attention, but I don't want to attract the wrong kind of attention. I wouldn't be able to sit through a movie thinking the car is sitting outside stripped to the frame. I know that sounds cynical, but there are people out there who like to take things that don't belong to them. I don't have the luxury of slamming the hood closed to secure the engine up. If I had a hood on, the carbs would still be sticking through it. The carbs, air cleaner, and other misc stuff would still be exposed and could be removed. So, since I don't plan on leaving it unattended, I don't bother covering it all up with a hood.
For those reasons, I would think long and hard about going with a tunnel ram.
Last edited by Camaro 69; 08-21-2009 at 01:22 AM.
#56
08-21-2009, 01:20 AM
Then swapping to a tunnel ram with dual 450 carbs (600's would be overkill) gave you 554 hp @ 6k rpm and 526 torque @ 4500 rpm.
For comparison sake, the tunnel ram showed 435 hp @ 4500 rpm, and the air-gap manifold with a single 750 carb gave 412 hp @ 4500 rpm. You can see how the tunnel ram builds more hp at the higher rpm range than the air-gap does.
For comparison sake, the tunnel ram showed 435 hp @ 4500 rpm, and the air-gap manifold with a single 750 carb gave 412 hp @ 4500 rpm. You can see how the tunnel ram builds more hp at the higher rpm range than the air-gap does.
Last edited by jason7504; 08-21-2009 at 01:23 AM.
#57
08-21-2009, 01:25 AM
If you want to go duals, Edelbrock makes an air-gap dual quad version.
I'd have to guess maybe in the 520 hp range @ 6k, and prolly in the upper 400's for tq.
There's only one thing I don't like about the tunnel ram, and that's a lack of security. If we're out with the car, say at a cruise night, then want to go out to eat at a restaurant or maybe see a movie, I'll take the car back home and go back out with the "normal" car. It can be a big inconvenience. For some reason, the car does attract attention, but I don't want to attract the wrong kind of attention. I wouldn't be able to sit through a movie thinking the car is sitting outside stripped to the frame. I know that sounds cynical, but there are people out there who like to take things that don't belong to them. I don't have the luxury of slamming the hood closed to secure the engine up. If I had a hood on, the carbs would still be sticking through it. The carbs, air cleaner, and other misc stuff would still be exposed and could be removed. So, since I don't plan on leaving it unattended, I don't bother covering it all up with a hood.
For those reasons, I would think long and hard about going with a tunnel ram.
I'd have to guess maybe in the 520 hp range @ 6k, and prolly in the upper 400's for tq.
There's only one thing I don't like about the tunnel ram, and that's a lack of security. If we're out with the car, say at a cruise night, then want to go out to eat at a restaurant or maybe see a movie, I'll take the car back home and go back out with the "normal" car. It can be a big inconvenience. For some reason, the car does attract attention, but I don't want to attract the wrong kind of attention. I wouldn't be able to sit through a movie thinking the car is sitting outside stripped to the frame. I know that sounds cynical, but there are people out there who like to take things that don't belong to them. I don't have the luxury of slamming the hood closed to secure the engine up. If I had a hood on, the carbs would still be sticking through it. The carbs, air cleaner, and other misc stuff would still be exposed and could be removed. So, since I don't plan on leaving it unattended, I don't bother covering it all up with a hood.
For those reasons, I would think long and hard about going with a tunnel ram.
yeah that is true about the tunnel ram. i would like to maybe go out to eat or see a movie when im cruising in my car and wouldnt be able to relax while knowing that my carbs might be stolen..oh no its not cynical..i would and will feel the same way..i would die if my car or anything got stolen..maybe i will just go with the dual quad
#58
08-21-2009, 01:29 AM
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The 'Burbs of Chicago
Posts: 18,306
I saw what you put before that ^. You musta read the specs again? lol
I'm just estimating the torque based on how much it jumped with the tunnel ram over the single air-gap man.
I'm just estimating the torque based on how much it jumped with the tunnel ram over the single air-gap man.
#59
08-21-2009, 01:38 AM
that extra like 50hp from the tunnel ram is tempting but then again 520 isn't so bad
and alot more convenient when cruising..i will be getting a 4" cowl induction hood too so i can use the dual quad
#60
08-21-2009, 01:46 AM
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The 'Burbs of Chicago
Posts: 18,306
I think you might be happier with it that way. 500-520 hp is no slouch of an engine. If your only intention is to take it out to a show, hang around a while, then go back home, a tunnel ram can be fun. But it doesn't always go like that, which is why I'm considering going a different route after I tire of it. You know how it goes, do it this way for a while, then on to something different.