A few ?? about GM supercharger for guys with more experience
#11
06-27-2010 | 01:56 PM
Overdrive Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,042
From: IL
Hahaha, if you're going to do that, make sure you start selling the design here and make a COMPLETE kit for others to buy -- then you will be off to the races! 
I am a Manufacturing engineer whos job was to trains young design engineers how design parts and the cost of those parts. Care to guess how much the custom elbow will cost you?
You design your elbow in CAD. Thats the easy parts. Takes maybe 2-3 hours. Then you will need a 3D printing of the of your design. The fondry can do it. but that will add another $250-$600 to their bill. If you go with a sand casting you will most likely get hit with a foundry min charge of $600. Their QA requirments for every order make it almost impossible to do anything cheap. Now you take it to a machine shop. To face it off and drill and tap 4 holes in a manual bridgeport type machine will take about 2.5 hours. You will need to do that twice . Once on both side. So that is about 5 hours total. Most shops are around 85 per hour. So your adapter is going to cost you atleast $1000. More likely $1500.
All that for 40 HP? You would be a lot better off with a tig welder and a drill press.
Your existing wiring harness will work.. You just need the computer tuned and you should upgrade your MAP sensor the L67 style. You should also upgrade your injectors.
It has been talked about many times on this site. With the compression in these motors you can not put much boost to them without an intercooler. That is why no one is trying to do what you want to do. If you research it you will also find its simple not worth it. Unless you are just doing if for bragging right. In which case please do a build thread here.
You design your elbow in CAD. Thats the easy parts. Takes maybe 2-3 hours. Then you will need a 3D printing of the of your design. The fondry can do it. but that will add another $250-$600 to their bill. If you go with a sand casting you will most likely get hit with a foundry min charge of $600. Their QA requirments for every order make it almost impossible to do anything cheap. Now you take it to a machine shop. To face it off and drill and tap 4 holes in a manual bridgeport type machine will take about 2.5 hours. You will need to do that twice . Once on both side. So that is about 5 hours total. Most shops are around 85 per hour. So your adapter is going to cost you atleast $1000. More likely $1500.
All that for 40 HP? You would be a lot better off with a tig welder and a drill press.
Your existing wiring harness will work.. You just need the computer tuned and you should upgrade your MAP sensor the L67 style. You should also upgrade your injectors.
It has been talked about many times on this site. With the compression in these motors you can not put much boost to them without an intercooler. That is why no one is trying to do what you want to do. If you research it you will also find its simple not worth it. Unless you are just doing if for bragging right. In which case please do a build thread here.
#12
06-27-2010 | 08:22 PM
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In the Staging Lanes
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 57
From: Golden City, MO (SW Missouri)
Gorn!
Dude! I found the article! Corection: passenger side intake, they flipped the monero elbow over. Still thinking of going with the tig welded idea for simplicity's sake. Monero parts are almost unobtainum...
These guys used an intercooler and it still fit... somehow? I still dont plan to though...
here are PICS:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3287/...d853da45_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3215/...c91408ef_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3018/...638fcbda_b.jpg
I think i am gonna stick with the TB off of a GTP just so mine is plug and play.
Dude! I found the article! Corection: passenger side intake, they flipped the monero elbow over. Still thinking of going with the tig welded idea for simplicity's sake. Monero parts are almost unobtainum...
These guys used an intercooler and it still fit... somehow? I still dont plan to though...here are PICS:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3287/...d853da45_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3215/...c91408ef_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3018/...638fcbda_b.jpg
I think i am gonna stick with the TB off of a GTP just so mine is plug and play.
Last edited by midwestdave33; 06-27-2010 at 08:26 PM.
#13
06-27-2010 | 08:31 PM
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In the Staging Lanes
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From: Golden City, MO (SW Missouri)
I definatly see a build thread in my future.....
Last edited by midwestdave33; 06-27-2010 at 08:38 PM.
#14
06-27-2010 | 09:00 PM
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We have seen that before, it been posted here a a few times. Remember that was a prototype shop that did that. I like how they said they just put the T56 in. LOL. While there is a bell housing and mounts you have to make everything else. I have seen one guy finish it. It cost him about 5K. You will end up making a lot more then just the TB adapter. By all means go for it I would love to follow along.
#16
06-27-2010 | 11:29 PM
Overdrive Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,042
From: IL
Build Build BUILD! ;-) I also would love to see this, plus based on that article, you should be up around the HP of the 2011 3.6L V6 Camaros or more... If someone could perfect a nice turn-key kit at a reasonable price, a lot of 3.8L Camaro owners may consider it before upgrading to a 5th Gen. and more monthly payments!!
Go for it, I think those interested here will help you with research as we are able... I will at least. :-D
Go for it, I think those interested here will help you with research as we are able... I will at least. :-D
#17
06-27-2010 | 11:34 PM
Overdrive Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,042
From: IL
I read that before and thanks for the repost. But where is page 37? The article is not over yet...
Gorn!
Dude! I found the article! Corection: passenger side intake, they flipped the monero elbow over. Still thinking of going with the tig welded idea for simplicity's sake. Monero parts are almost unobtainum... These guys used an intercooler and it still fit... somehow? I still dont plan to though...
I think i am gonna stick with the TB off of a GTP just so mine is plug and play.
Dude! I found the article! Corection: passenger side intake, they flipped the monero elbow over. Still thinking of going with the tig welded idea for simplicity's sake. Monero parts are almost unobtainum...
These guys used an intercooler and it still fit... somehow? I still dont plan to though...I think i am gonna stick with the TB off of a GTP just so mine is plug and play.
#18
06-28-2010 | 01:06 AM
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In the Staging Lanes
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 57
From: Golden City, MO (SW Missouri)
Um, I actually located it on another forum. :-O A guy scanned his issue of the old mag and posted photos. He neglected the rest. THEREFORE! I emailed the magizine and requested a old copy from their reprint division.
#19
06-28-2010 | 01:25 AM
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In the Staging Lanes
Joined: May 2010
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From: Golden City, MO (SW Missouri)
other can o' worms.
I've by no means finished my pre project research. Just scratched the surface more like it. Like i said, i'm a very **** engineer and like to be armed to the hilt with information. I'll be at the dealer, junkyeard and O'Reillys comparing Pricing and measuring anything i even suspect might be different for the next several weeks if not a month or two.... You under estimate my thriftyness and patience.
I'd be willing to bet i can do it for less than half that. If i had 5K i'd buy a FFF turbo! Was the guy crazy or just made of money?!? I'm neither, i know when to quit spending money i don't absolutely have to. and when to buy used and when not to. And i bet he contracted alot of stuff out... Or ugraded a bunch of internals. Oh, Are you including my plans for rockers, pully, and headers in that number?
Last edited by midwestdave33; 06-28-2010 at 01:36 AM.
#20
06-28-2010 | 05:06 AM
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There is also another guy that fab up his own system. There is a thread on another sight and even a video of its first test drive. I will look for when I get a chance.
The reason I mention the T56 thing is I know the amount of work that is involved in that swap and they blew it off like it was nothing.
Your cheapest way to fab up the adapter is to make (2) 3/16" plates. One to match the super charger and one to match TB. You should be able to make that with a drill and a set of torches or a Die grinder and a lot of time
. Now bend up a metal bracket that will hold the two pcs where you want them in the car. This bracket does not need to follow the tube just position the flanges. Now take some wire and bend it ruffly where your want the tub. Now take a page from a custom header builder and connect the flanges with the pipe. It will take a lot of test fitting but you can get it. The reason I say this is because while Cad is great it is only as good at the information you already have. To do it right in Cad you would need most of the engine and cowl/hood already drawn to scale.
If you do not know how a custom header is made here is a good How to video.
http://smartflix.com/store/video/141...ng-with-Tubing
As you can see I have been thinking a lot about it. But remember there where kits for both a turbo and a super charge availible for our cars. They have both been droped. There is only one reason to drop a kit that is already developed. Lack of sales. Being different is cool but if there is a kit your not being different and why put that much effort into a V6 when you can by a V8 with a blown headgasket for $1200 and in a weekend have a 300 HP car.
For you I think this would be a great project. Not that its worth it car wise but any fab work is good for someone going into mechanical design.
Edit: I knew we talked about this before. I found the thread. There is a link inside this thread from a guy name merlin. he has a build thread. This thread is poster one our FAQ sticky. Note: ther first picture shown is not a 4th gen. I can see the firewall and the back of the valve cover
https://camaroforums.com/forum/93-02-v6-tech-14/3-8-v6-inititial-mod-guide-32868/
The reason I mention the T56 thing is I know the amount of work that is involved in that swap and they blew it off like it was nothing.
Your cheapest way to fab up the adapter is to make (2) 3/16" plates. One to match the super charger and one to match TB. You should be able to make that with a drill and a set of torches or a Die grinder and a lot of time
. Now bend up a metal bracket that will hold the two pcs where you want them in the car. This bracket does not need to follow the tube just position the flanges. Now take some wire and bend it ruffly where your want the tub. Now take a page from a custom header builder and connect the flanges with the pipe. It will take a lot of test fitting but you can get it. The reason I say this is because while Cad is great it is only as good at the information you already have. To do it right in Cad you would need most of the engine and cowl/hood already drawn to scale. If you do not know how a custom header is made here is a good How to video.
http://smartflix.com/store/video/141...ng-with-Tubing
As you can see I have been thinking a lot about it. But remember there where kits for both a turbo and a super charge availible for our cars. They have both been droped. There is only one reason to drop a kit that is already developed. Lack of sales. Being different is cool but if there is a kit your not being different and why put that much effort into a V6 when you can by a V8 with a blown headgasket for $1200 and in a weekend have a 300 HP car.
For you I think this would be a great project. Not that its worth it car wise but any fab work is good for someone going into mechanical design.
Edit: I knew we talked about this before. I found the thread. There is a link inside this thread from a guy name merlin. he has a build thread. This thread is poster one our FAQ sticky. Note: ther first picture shown is not a 4th gen. I can see the firewall and the back of the valve cover
https://camaroforums.com/forum/93-02-v6-tech-14/3-8-v6-inititial-mod-guide-32868/
Last edited by Gorn; 06-28-2010 at 10:06 AM.