Please go easy on me first post at this sight. I am a "car guy" and a Chevy guy, very informed on C2 63-67 (pic of my 66 attached) and early C3 Corvettes. But not so much early Camaros, always liked them. I looking at buying a 67-69 Camaro. This one caught my eye as I am leaning towards a vert and that really limits what is out there. I know the original 307 is a mild motor at best, but that is not a big deal for me. This is more of a top down cruiser for me. I like the 4 speed Muncie manual conversion. Should I be Leary of the "all new metal" does that mean a bunch of after-market panels? If so, what is the typical fit, finish, and quality of them? What are your HONEST thoughts on this car. Not going to offend me, I am not set on it at all, just wanted opinions from people far more knowledgeable than me on these early Camaros. https://www.ebay.com/itm/175215967407

Thanks to all, and happy to find this site. - Jon

 

Welcome to CF,love the Vette that's a stunner!
Thr Camaro sure looks like it was well done from what I can see in the pictures.
Price seems a little steep maybe but they probably spent that much to have it all done,if it was priced to sell it would already be gone IMO
For that kind of money I'd want a real expert to go over the car with a fine toothed comb before pulling the trigger.
The 307 is a dog no doubt about that,the 4 speed is a waste behind that slug they should have left the auto in it but it'll run 'till the cows come home.
A guy could swap in a 300 hp 350 crate motor easy enough to have a little get up and go and set the original 307 in storage to have it with the stock auto the ad says is available so you have all the numbers matching parts.

 

Thanks for the kind words and the reply! My thoughts were to keep the auto matching numbers trans. that he has in storage (I have the room) run the 307 a bit. Keep the 307 with the trans. once pulled. If I am going to go through the trouble and expense of a motor swap I think I would do something a bit more serious. I know it would be more money, but like a Bill Mitchel 427 small block? It is not something (motor swap) I would need to do right away. It's an M20 Muncie, same ones they used in the Vettes of that era. I think it can handle a 427 S/B power? I changed my Vette trans to a 5 speed Tremec as it has a 4:11 rear and it just ran crazy high rpm's on the highway. I think that car can be had for about 60k. What would you think of it 7-8k less than the ad is asking? Foe what it is worth, my 66 Vette is a numbers matching 327 L79 option - 350 h.p. with pretty rare (11%) factory air. It's a great motor for the car. A 427 BB would certainly be more valuable, but only add 40 h.p.p (both stock) and a bunch more weight, and all front end weight at that.

 

Well if you put that much power to her she'll need a rear end upgrade with multi leaf springs,that single leaf 10 bolt could break and destroy the whole car.
You'll also want subframe connectors to avoid twisting the body and I'd want a scatter shield with most likely a clutch upgrade depending on what's in there now.
Other this as well like it'll probably want a cooling system upgrade,I'd imagine a 427 small block makes some heat.
Pricepoint? I'd do some research,prices are all over the map om 1st gen Camaros so it's hard to say. Check out some completed auctions.

 

I think you want the M22 with that 427. The M22 was designed for high torque big blocks. I noticed the X brace is missing on ebay car. That is a no no, you can twist the car. While torque from a 307 won't cause the twist going around corners hard can damage the car.

IMO Rag tops in there stock form should not really be hot rodded. You can get away with a stronger X brace and frame connectors and a well designed roll cage with supports running to the sub-frame. To do it right you should just add a tubular frame the body just sits in.

Keep in mine it is a unibody so when you open the doors and look through the car the only thing you are seeing is sheet metal connecting the front and back of the car. Unlike your vet which has a full boxed frame. If you put a jack under the lower control arm and jack it up you will be amazed how high you can get one tire off the ground before the second lifts off the ground. They are the wet noddle's of the muscle car era. I am not hating on rag tops I love mine but mine will never be a fast car. If I wanted a fast 1st gen I would buy a hard top.

Just incase you did not know. GM engineers did not want to put big blocks in convertibles. They said the body did not have the structure for it and was not designed for it. Marketing won that fight and management forced the issue . When marketing wanted a Z28 rag top the engineers said many cars would not make it out of the 12 month warranty with out twisting the body. Management backed the engineers. That is why there are no first gen rag top Z28s, well there is one that that is a whole other story.

 

Great info from both you and Y2kEglide. I am probably getting out of hand with major HP/TQ 427 SB ideas on this car. So what would you say would be safe down the road with this car being a vert and OEM frame and rear diff. not designed for major motor mods? 300-400 hp a mild built 350 or a streetable 383? Do you think the car is over-priced as it sits now? (I think they are all over-prided today but that is another chapter) in the 60k or low 60k area? I have looked at a bunch of verts, and there are not many to begin with, and this car keeps coming back to me. I am not really a fan of the white interior, but I think it really works with this car/combo. Thanks again.

 

I think all the first gens are over priced considering I paid $6500 for mine. The RS package does not effect the drive line. So unless options where ordered it probably have a 10 bolt open rear and a Saginaw 4 speed. That is not going to hold up to a lot of torque. I broke a Saginaw case in a 300+ hp 350 racing but i know people that have had much better luck then I did.

The amount of stress the body sees is a function of Torque, Traction and how you drive it. IMO a stout 383 can have 450 Ft/lbs of torque. Add in the big meaty radial and some clutch dumps at 4500 RPMs you could damage the body or the rear. The SS came with a much stronger 12 bolt rear. now if you go with a low profile tire you are not going to near the torque twist on lunch.

 

OP

The car presents well in pics.....with that said you absolutely need a qualified inspection/appraisal. Those can run $400-$500 but given the price point $ well invested/ IMHO the FS $ is high. More mid $50k at best assuming inspection comes back to support that. However now, like everything else $ are stupid high. Collector car $ go up/down long term so now its at high up trend

Absolutely need the vert brace regardless of engine and a good exhaust shop can make the dual with X pipe work with that but likely need 2 1/4" or oval pipe for that section. I have seen it done.

Sub frame connectors are a must. Several brands, some stupid $. Mine are $119 Summit brand

Engin, Yeah the 307 is going to feel like a 6 cyl but OK for just cruising. I would, and did, get a Blueprint Engines 357 making 411hp/413/tq with a Eddy 600 cfm carb. That kind of HP & TQ will make it a very fun street car. If the rear is a 8.2 10 bolt it will hold up fine with that kind of power, mine does

If you have a Muncie it will hold that power, Saginaw not so much. A TKO like your vette would be ideal if swapping trans

Those long tubes are nice but the starter will not be happy long. The Remy offset gear reduction version (c0mplete bolt on) will help as it is smaller and also much more starting power. I got mine at Rockauto

Car has basically had all its sheet metal replaced so original car must have been in very rough shape. There is no doubt north of $60+k in that car build but owner crossed the line on ROI

If it was a 396, Muncie car in that condition (original) it would be in the $ range asking

The VIN and cowl tag will clarify what it was originally but 69, unlike 67 was less 411 on cowl tag

more 1st gen traffic on Team Camaro site....and likely more discerning opinions also

Good luck on your search. I spent over a year and found my coupe in AZ. Bidding on another private seller car now (not a 1st gen) so know the dance on online buying. If you can not personally see the car, get a professional service to do so. Seems like based on your vette you have a clue so buy a plane ticket or hire someone to inspect it

 

Great info SoCal67 I sent you a pm.