Supercharger / Turbocharger ??
#1
11-29-2010, 11:43 PM
Supercharger / Turbocharger ??
Can anyone point me in the direction of some info on supercharging or turbocharging a 3.8 in a 96 or have any info they can pass along?
I appreciate all the help...
Kimbo
I appreciate all the help...
Kimbo
#3
11-30-2010, 12:17 AM
Once again Buffalo, you're in an area where you don't belong and did not address the OP's question at all.
A supercharger is basically out of the question unless you have infinite amounts of time and money to have something fabbed up. A turbocharger is more practical. But depending on your current setup, it could cost anywhere from $5K-$10K or more. You also have to consider a tune for it will be expensive because it will pretty much have to be dyno-tuned, which could run $500+. I plan on turboing my car, which has a good setup for it now, so it would cost me around $5k for the setup. Even though I just rebuilt the engine, I'd probably tear it apart again to maximize the amount of boost it can handle. If you're really serious about getting into the turbo setup, I would head over to fullthrottlev6.com and talk to some guys that are boost-crazy over there. Guys that have actually turbocharged their V6s and get good, experienced information from them. If you're not ready to get that financially deep into your car, I would suggest exhaust and suspension modifications for now if you haven't already. I have $10K+ invested into my car in only a little over a year. And I'm not done with her yet. Just because it's not a V8 doesn't mean it won't be able to beat one.
A supercharger is basically out of the question unless you have infinite amounts of time and money to have something fabbed up. A turbocharger is more practical. But depending on your current setup, it could cost anywhere from $5K-$10K or more. You also have to consider a tune for it will be expensive because it will pretty much have to be dyno-tuned, which could run $500+. I plan on turboing my car, which has a good setup for it now, so it would cost me around $5k for the setup. Even though I just rebuilt the engine, I'd probably tear it apart again to maximize the amount of boost it can handle. If you're really serious about getting into the turbo setup, I would head over to fullthrottlev6.com and talk to some guys that are boost-crazy over there. Guys that have actually turbocharged their V6s and get good, experienced information from them. If you're not ready to get that financially deep into your car, I would suggest exhaust and suspension modifications for now if you haven't already. I have $10K+ invested into my car in only a little over a year. And I'm not done with her yet. Just because it's not a V8 doesn't mean it won't be able to beat one.
#4
11-30-2010, 12:32 AM
Here's a question. Would you rather spend $5,000-$10,000 on forced induction for a V6 or trade the car in and get a Z28 with decent mileage that has the power that a turbo/supercharged V6 would? The Z28 would also more than likely have more drivability than the turbo/supercharged V6 Camaro.
#5
11-30-2010, 01:25 AM
Basically my Camaro was my first car and the motor is a stock V6 with about 153,000 miles on it so I'm just trying to put the pros/cons together, ya know? I don't, by any means, want to get rid of the car so the debate is whether supercharging/turbocharging the car vs. swapping engines and having to deal with the whole front end, brake work, etc of a V8. I have Flowmaster exhaust set up and a brand new suspension (front and rear) with new springs and the such. The body is in great condition with paint that is less then a year old and the interior is in great condition as well so the outside and interior of the car is basically brand new...just need to start making the engine and transmission right...
Buffalo02Z28 - I agree with you that it would be "easiest" to just swap it for a Z28 or an SS but, as I stated above, I have pretty strong ties to that car. Basically just trying to talk myself through the pros/cons of a V8 swap or working on my V6 with people who have done it and what they think because the car isn't going anywhere...
DarlingReject - I really appreciate the info, thanks for the time...I will definitely check out the website you mentioned for sure. My intention, regardless of which route I go is to get a new engine and rebuild the entire thing on a stand and when it is setup the way I want it then swap it out for my stock motor in my car...we shall see...again, thanks for the help.
Buffalo02Z28 - I agree with you that it would be "easiest" to just swap it for a Z28 or an SS but, as I stated above, I have pretty strong ties to that car. Basically just trying to talk myself through the pros/cons of a V8 swap or working on my V6 with people who have done it and what they think because the car isn't going anywhere...
DarlingReject - I really appreciate the info, thanks for the time...I will definitely check out the website you mentioned for sure. My intention, regardless of which route I go is to get a new engine and rebuild the entire thing on a stand and when it is setup the way I want it then swap it out for my stock motor in my car...we shall see...again, thanks for the help.
#6
11-30-2010, 01:36 AM
I don't think that you would want to do a V8 swap. You would need to buy a wrecked Z28 or SS to gather the parts from. The car will basically be a Z28 in a V6 body. Forced induction is a better way to go.
#7
11-30-2010, 09:04 AM
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tokeland, Washington
Posts: 21,645
#8
11-30-2010, 09:15 AM
RyanKimberly
Fullthrottlev6.com. Go to the GM Forced induction section.
Besides Musicman, I'm not sure how many more 6ers are boosted on here, but on that forum there are a bunch of guys. Its the best place I have been able to find for info regarding boosting these cars from people who have actually boosted these cars. There are a few kits out there-they just cost way too much. Force Fed Fabrications makes one. Google them. Email them.
You can usually find members that are selling their kits or parts of their kits on the forum. Just read a lot. I hardly know anything regarding this topic, but have read so much that I understand why its so expensive and where most of your money would go.
The trade up to a v8 issue does come up anytime anyone wants to bring this topic up, but the points Buffalo is bringing up are solid. If you want it done right, it honestly will probably cost you $5k+ depending on what you're capable of doing yourself. You hear of cheaper builds, but they are either "future" builds, not daily drivers, did almost all of the work themselves, or haven't been tested for the long run. Most solid boosted builds have some real $ dropped into them. Also, the v8 in stock form with the same amount of power will 9 times out of 10 be a more reliable car. Again, not in every case, but in most cases this will be true.
Also, welcome to the forum. Preeee Paaaaare 4 The Drama. :P
Fullthrottlev6.com. Go to the GM Forced induction section.
Besides Musicman, I'm not sure how many more 6ers are boosted on here, but on that forum there are a bunch of guys. Its the best place I have been able to find for info regarding boosting these cars from people who have actually boosted these cars. There are a few kits out there-they just cost way too much. Force Fed Fabrications makes one. Google them. Email them.
You can usually find members that are selling their kits or parts of their kits on the forum. Just read a lot. I hardly know anything regarding this topic, but have read so much that I understand why its so expensive and where most of your money would go.
The trade up to a v8 issue does come up anytime anyone wants to bring this topic up, but the points Buffalo is bringing up are solid. If you want it done right, it honestly will probably cost you $5k+ depending on what you're capable of doing yourself. You hear of cheaper builds, but they are either "future" builds, not daily drivers, did almost all of the work themselves, or haven't been tested for the long run. Most solid boosted builds have some real $ dropped into them. Also, the v8 in stock form with the same amount of power will 9 times out of 10 be a more reliable car. Again, not in every case, but in most cases this will be true.
Also, welcome to the forum. Preeee Paaaaare 4 The Drama. :P
#9
11-30-2010, 09:44 AM
First off let me be the first to welcome you to the forums.
Dont be put off by people here that jump on you right off the bat and say get a V8, or dont swap a V6 for a V8 since it takes alot of work.
Forced induction can be done in F-bodies. Both via turbo and SC. With the SC we have one advantage, there is already an engine built that almost drops into our cars that comes from the factory with a good SC... BUT... getting that setup to work takes some serious skills and $$$ that were mentioned above. Has it been done? Yes, believe it or not GM did it to a firebird using mainly parts off their shelf. Was it easy? NO that is why GM never put it into production.
As for a turbo there are alot more people out there doing a turbo setup than the SC for the simple reason that it is cheaper and requires less fab skills. You can pull good power from a turbo but like with a SC'd engine you need to build the engine for the boost.
The most important thing you can do to boost and engine is beef it up. Boosting puts alot of stress on ALL the parts you need to make sure your engine can handle it all. Also you will need a cam that is profiled for either SC or Turbo. They are not the same. A Turbo cam maximises RPM and exhaust pressure to increase the impeller speed where a SC cam works on the torque and intake valve efficency to reduce parasitic loss. A SC cam WILL NOT perform well in a turbo engine and visa-versa. Also after either is done you should get the car dyno'd. Around my neck of the woods the shops here (3 locally) charge about $300 for a N/A engine and more for SC and Turbos. This includes adjusting the shift points to get the most of the new power.
If you do want to do the swap to V8, it does take alot of time and a few extra $$$s as well. If you do want to do this get a doner car with the engine and trans you want. Dont try to mix match!! the engines and trans and wiring are all tied together and the PCM also is set for your engine trans combo. Once you have found your doner car make sure everything works in it before you try to swap it all over. If you know it is good when you start then you know the problems you have after are from the swap and not the original car. Oh and depending on the years you may be swapping everything from one car to the next except the carpet. Go to the V6 forum and check out the engine swap sticky. I put a post in there about swapping from a 96 3.8L to a 2000 SS. I helped my friend do this swap, it took him about 80hrs with 2 people over a week and a half and that was with both cars side by side in a 2 car garage.
I hope this provides helpful
Massey
Dont be put off by people here that jump on you right off the bat and say get a V8, or dont swap a V6 for a V8 since it takes alot of work.
Forced induction can be done in F-bodies. Both via turbo and SC. With the SC we have one advantage, there is already an engine built that almost drops into our cars that comes from the factory with a good SC... BUT... getting that setup to work takes some serious skills and $$$ that were mentioned above. Has it been done? Yes, believe it or not GM did it to a firebird using mainly parts off their shelf. Was it easy? NO that is why GM never put it into production.
As for a turbo there are alot more people out there doing a turbo setup than the SC for the simple reason that it is cheaper and requires less fab skills. You can pull good power from a turbo but like with a SC'd engine you need to build the engine for the boost.
The most important thing you can do to boost and engine is beef it up. Boosting puts alot of stress on ALL the parts you need to make sure your engine can handle it all. Also you will need a cam that is profiled for either SC or Turbo. They are not the same. A Turbo cam maximises RPM and exhaust pressure to increase the impeller speed where a SC cam works on the torque and intake valve efficency to reduce parasitic loss. A SC cam WILL NOT perform well in a turbo engine and visa-versa. Also after either is done you should get the car dyno'd. Around my neck of the woods the shops here (3 locally) charge about $300 for a N/A engine and more for SC and Turbos. This includes adjusting the shift points to get the most of the new power.
If you do want to do the swap to V8, it does take alot of time and a few extra $$$s as well. If you do want to do this get a doner car with the engine and trans you want. Dont try to mix match!! the engines and trans and wiring are all tied together and the PCM also is set for your engine trans combo. Once you have found your doner car make sure everything works in it before you try to swap it all over. If you know it is good when you start then you know the problems you have after are from the swap and not the original car. Oh and depending on the years you may be swapping everything from one car to the next except the carpet. Go to the V6 forum and check out the engine swap sticky. I put a post in there about swapping from a 96 3.8L to a 2000 SS. I helped my friend do this swap, it took him about 80hrs with 2 people over a week and a half and that was with both cars side by side in a 2 car garage.
I hope this provides helpful
Massey
#10
11-30-2010, 12:01 PM
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tokeland, Washington
Posts: 21,645
agree with massey and to add to it, the car will be worth less money after the switch, thats right no one wants a frankin car. so theres another reason its a bad idea switching a base camaro to a v8 camaro.