The "Slow but Steady" '78 Project Build
 

At long last, the fun part of my '78 project is underway! As many are aware, I have been plagued by some really bizarre electrical issues that held me back for pretty much another year. Although I'm not completely certain the gremlins have been eradicated, I'm confident enough (with a bunch of new wiring) that it's time to move forward with the more enjoyable work. I am taking A LOT of pictures and videos of my progress so I can use as a reference and be able to look back at some point in the far distant future and appreciate my efforts. I am in no way a "seasoned" automotive restoration expert and my mechanical abilities are pretty much a "learn as you go" kind of approach. As always, insight and guidance are extremely appreciated as I'm sure there will be many questions. I'm not doing a full restoration to this Camaro, only trying to make it "nice" and "clean" and DRIVEABLE. I'm hoping this project thread can help someone else out with questions they might have with their projects and to prove to others on the fence that this is doable with motivation and some basic knowledge of cars (oh yeah, and the cash!) The cash part is my issue with being able to complete this project quickly, not gonna happen... It'll be a work in progress for quite some time.

Here's some stock pics of the Camaro when I bought it last summer. I'm going to jump forward a bit the next couple of posts and get caught up to where I'm at now.

Few more pictures. At the end of last summer I had the rear end work done so that was a good start! Replaced the open carrier that had 2.41 gears to a Detroit Truetrac with 3.90's. I also replaced the dash gauge faces to white and added a tach. I put a new temp and oil press. gauge in the factory bezel and added green LED's to the cluster (my 9yr old sons choce.) It looks pretty good at night I must say.

Couple more, the body isn't terrible and overall is pretty solid compared to others I've heard about or seen. The panels all need a little work but the floors are all solid and the trunk is like new still. I'm focusing on the engine swap now and I'm cleaning up all the front end stuff and repainting everthing while it's all apart. Body work will be after the Camaro drives again.

This is where I'm at as of today. Should have the engine/trans out and I'm trying to keep the exhaust all in one piece to hopefully sell. It's all pretty much new but is single into the D/O Flowmaster which is not what I want for the new setup. I'm cleaning everything up the best I can without access to a blaster. The core support looks like it's in great shape and should clean up well. My problem is I can't decide what paint to use for the firewall/frame etc.? Will be powerwashing everything first and then a lot of wire wheeling to get things as good as I possibly can before paint.

I like satin black. It looks good with any color body, and is easily touched up if you bump it or get any scratches later.

I was thinking a satin or semi-gloss black but not sure if I should use POR 15 or Extreme Chassis Black or? Got the engine and trans out today so now I can start cleaning everything up! What a bear doing that by myself but it feels good to have it done that's for sure. I just wish I had a few more days like today with the weather. Now it's supposed to rain and drop about 25 degrees for tomorrow....figures. Oh well, guess I can work on finishing up the port matching and polishing of my intake if need be.

That always happens when you don't have a garage, and you start a project. Might want to get a cheap 10'x20' canopy and put it up to keep things from getting wet. I built my whole car in one!

I do have a garage Val, the Camaro is in there now. I just mean that I need to get it outside to do the power washing and all the grinding/sanding. The canopy would be nice but I live in northern Michigan and winter is almost here. The snow would make short work of the canopy I'm afraid. I really need to add a small port onto my garage so I have a place to park my truck (winter vehicle) while I've got the Camaro torn apart. I fit 3 vehicles in there last winter but it didn't leave but a couple feet of room on either side of the Camaro. Too hard to work on it like that obviously. I don't even want to think about how long it's gonna take to wire wheel everything. That's really why I need the weather to hold out for a while longer My timinig is lousy, I should've been doing this work back in June. I'm just really glad to be making progress on something rather than losing my mind trying to figure out why the alternator wouldn't charge the battery!

I forgot to ask a question about the fuel lines coming from the tank. The return line was blocked off with a bolt in the hose right by the fuel pump, is this normal? I don't really understand the purpose of a return line (excuse the ignorance) but do I need to have it hooked up when I get the 327 in? I'll still be using a mechanical pump with a regulator that I got for the new setup. Kind of a dumb question to be asking now but I was wondering about that today when I was looking at it...

Hey dont worry about about putting it off, most of the people on here at one time or another have stopped on their projects more then once and took a breather, i took almost 10 years from the time i parked my car until i started working on it again. Hell i just took an 6 or 8 month holiday on mine.

Cant help with the fuel question but i hope to be able to answer some questions in the future for you. I have an electric pump and dont believe i have a return line if that makes a difference.

Keep up the good work, it would make it a bit easier if you used the IMG code to post your pictures too!

Good luck

Funny what you said about the snow killing the canopy. I have seen it too. I watched two buddies go in on 101/2 conduit and tarps to cover their cars. A 67 Camaro and a 86 Cutlass fresh from paint. By the end of winter the tarps were laying on top of both cars with two feet of snow on that.

You don't need a return line, and I didn't know a '78 ever had one. (new to me) You might not even have a place to connect that return line, and it may be someone used a newer pump and simply plugged the extra line.
I don't use a return line on my mechanical, or my other car with electric pump. Only reason for the return line is to bleed off excess pressure that backs up at the regulator/carb.

Thanks Vall, I can maybe try to remove it back at the tank? I need to be back there anyway to finish removing the tailpipes and muffler that are left hangin' there so I'll try to take a look. You're right too, my new pump doesn't even have a place for a return line, I checked last night.

Sudstoy - I am in full agreement with you on the "relief" breaks. Those will come sometime in Jan/Feb when it's "negative something" outside and it's too much of a PITA to go out and work. Right now I'm racing against mother nature to get the outside stuff done. We've gone from 70's all week to chance for snow on Saturday here! That really sucks. Also, I appreciate your suggestion to use IMG for pics but I can't get that to work? Any suggestions? Thanks again.

Damon - I've seen some friends do the exact same thing, always with the same end result. I just figure there's a reason why the trend here is metal roofs. My garage is a metal structure and I might just add some kind of lean-to onto the side of it with some posts, 2x8's and a couple more pieces of metal roof and siding.

Next Question = Suspension. I've pretty much decided to change out some stuff while the front end is apart. Everything looks surprisingly good by way of bushings (except the sway bar links that I broke both bolts on ystrday) but for the money ($140) I can get everything but springs,shocks and new control arms. This car will be used for cruising around in (at a very fast pace) but not for any type of road racing etc. My logic is that the Camaro came with the F41 "upgrade" so that should be good enough for me. My question is polyurethane bushings instead of replacement parts? The price is right for the factory replacement stuff but is there a genuine reason why I should go with the poly stuff? I've never done any suspension work and I'm kinda excited to get that stuff apart. It looks really easy (minus the springs) and I can be working on that now to save me some sanding! Sorry for being so long winded, can't help it!

I went with poly on mine, and used all the stock arms, etc. Some people have complained of squeaks in poly bushings, but I've also heard others never have squeaks. The key seems to be liberal use of the proper grease for poly bushings. I bought an 8 oz. can of extra grease, as the small packet that came with the bushings is nowhere near enough. The common spot for squeaks is the end washers on the upper arms, so I made sure they had a ton of grease. But I also liberally greased everything that moves, so I've had no squeaking.

I think I'm going to get the center link/tie rod/ball joint kit and then save up for a bushing kit(+ grease;).) The body mount bushings are shot and the kit will take care of those, do the rest of the front end and give what I need for the back of the car too. I can reuse the control arms and that should take care of it. Time to pull everything apart and get cleaning! I wonder if the molasses solution will work on rusty parts when the weather gets colder?

I put pst bushings in mine 14 or so years ago. In the short amount I drove it I never had squeaks. I did cost them with grease.

If you plan to soak the parts, and not just brush the molasses solution on, then it should work. Only problem will be if it gets to freezing temps. Might be spring before you get the parts out! ;)

That'd be pretty an interesting sight, a gigantic garbage can sized chunk of ice with control arms, hood hinges etc encased in the middle! I'm gonna try it this week, anything I can do to save some grinder work I'm going for. We're gonna be pretty chilly at night but I should be safe for a while I think. Just didn't know if the colder temps would cause any of the "process" to not work. I bet it'll take longer but if I can get that stuff done in the next couple of weeks I should be good. Plus, I'll have some solution already made for spring! Onward...

As for the pictures, get a photobucket account, its free. Then download the pictures to photobucket.

Once you have done that you can copy a link from there. This is an example of one of my photos but i have added the spaces to make it work on here without showing the picture.

[ IMG ]http://i1229.photobucket.com/albums/ee469/Sudstoy/DSC01643.jpg[ / IMG ]

Thanks for the info about photobucket. I'll do that sometime soon and post from there. Haven't gotten much done so far this week, kids have a tendency to hamper progress, which is fine with me. I'll get busy in the next couple days and get some more pics of of the firewall cleanup.

Question - I'm wondering about the replacement of the brake lines. Some are brand new but I was curious if I could use some kind of braided lines instead of the metal/stainless steel? Wasn't sure if that could be done or not. Not looking forward to bending new lines and really don't want to buy a bunch of costly tools (bender/flaring etc.) to do a job one time and never use them again.

I have learned something this week. I would MUCH rather be working on the Camaro (or cleaning up after a Great Dane in the yard for that matter) than trying to replace exhaust manifold gaskets on a Ford!! I finally got sick to death of the annoying "tick tick tick" as you drive because ALL F150's have the same problem of exhaust studs rotting right off and/or breaking off at the head. What a PITA!

I did manage to get the Molasses mixture (or Halloween potion as my daughter called it) going this week and I can already tell it's going to take longer with the colder temps. I'll get some before and after pics up when I actually get some results. Not much else got done this week per the above paragraph but if the rain will stop for a few hours I'll be getting the firewall done this week.

Hope the molasses works. If it does, I may try it on my recent acquisition. Got an old cooler chest yesterday, and it needs restoration, plus surface rust neutralized:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...y/DSCF3486.jpg

That looks pretty cool! I can tell that the molasses is working but it's not working as well/quickly as I've seen before. Knew it going into this that it would probably take longer and that's fine. I'm going to give it at least another week before I even look at things and I'll try to get a couple pics up then.

Molasses? Did I miss something? I never heard of that as a rust remover.

Youtube it. A molasses mixture isn't caustic or as corrosive as an acid based chemical is. But it works as slow as.....well you get the idea. ;)
You let the part soak in a vat, and it could be for weeks depending on how rusty the part is.

It's really quite an amazing process if you've got the time to let them soak, and I've got the time. Also, like '69 said, it's not a harsh process like the acid based chemicals are. There are faster processes but I wasn't really feeling the battery charger next to the water container....

Double double toil and trouble
rusty parts soak and the molasses cauldron bubbles...

It's working good! I could rub the rust off the headlight buckets with my thumb when I checked them today so it's almost time. I'm actually kind of glad that it's cooler out as the smell would be really strong in the garage if it was warmer. It does take a while for the molasses to work but right now i'm not really pressed so time isn't an issue. I'm going to give these parts until Monday and power wash them and post some pics.

I've been trying to get some pics up of the rust free parts out of the molasses and have had a years worth of problems all fall into the last two weeks...

Broken pressure washer (kinda needed for the molasses parts)
Broken chainsaw - tried to save some $ this year and get some of my own firewood. Didn't work out the way I intended.
Broken Truck again (yeah, it's a Ford) Had to drill and tap the head for 2 exhaust studs and then the belt tensioner decided to seize and break into pieces on my way home with my buddy's snowblower in the back.
Broken Great Dane - emergency surgery on a bleeding well, you don't wanna know.

Throw in the usual stuff this time of year like trying to de-leaf 2 acres of yard completely surrounded by maples, oaks, birch, elm and ash while having the rain and wind make it even more fun and I just haven't had ANY time to do anything Camaro related. Before all this BS started happening I had just about finished sanding the firewall and almost have it ready for paint. Anyway, I will get some pics up ASAP as the parts all look awesome that I soaked in the solution! Pressure washer is next on this list. I tell ya what, stuff like this sure makes me realize how truly enjoyable it is to work on the Camaro!

Apologies for the rant.

Sandy sure did send a cold blast at us huh? I froze my grapes off trick or treating with my boys. I kept waiting for the "daddy I'm cold." Then boom were goin home guys. I didn't want to cut their night short so I waited for them to tell me but that was still longer than I wanted to freeze.

Agreed, I'm really not ready for the cold this year. Just making it harder on myself by dreading winter, living where I live. My kids did the same thing trick or treating, usually they're done with time to spare. Not this year, my daughter almost fell asleep standing up at the last house "but I'm not cold Daddy!" Wasn't the way I wanted to warm up but carrying her back helped a bit. Now it's time to go spend more money on a garage heater. I will not be waiting half a day this year for the woodburner to warm it up..... got things to do!

I brought the wagon. I had to carry them home last years.

OK so I'm whittlin' away at my list of problems, taking care of business and I'm more than ready to dive back into the front end of the Camaro. Have a question or two if I could ask:

1. Any tips/tricks to getting the steering apart? I'm going to replace the gear box as it's leaking and I don't know how to replace the seals. Should I take things apart where the rag joint is? I'm not removing the column and only need to get it apart by the gear box. Just not sure the best way to do it.

2. - And this'll probably be a palm to the forehead question for many but I've never done this before... When I remove the front subframe from the body, do I need to mark/line things up for reinstallation? I've read something about tape on the floor but don't remember if that's what it was for. Sorry for the ignorance, just trying to make some progress.

I would pull it apart at the rag joint. Plus plan on replacing the bolts for the steering box. I have the set from my 78 in the garage. They are litterally 50% rusted in half and that amount of lost metal goes along for about three inches. Scarey for sure. I was going to post up here and tell people to check theirs because the subframe on the car was excellent. The rad support was perfect.

The subframe has two alignment holes on the mounts at the firewall. That will get you close. Then you have to cross measure to make sure its square. Here is a good place to start. I suggest printing this and laminating it. Then tape it to the wall of the garage. Second Generation Camaro Group - Frame Checking & Dimensions

Thanks very much Damon, I haven't pulled the box yet but I'll remember to check the bolts. I'm slowly replacing almost ALL bolts as I go so I'll add 3 more. Haven't seen any BAD ones yet but I'm curious now. The frame and core support are in beautiful shape so I'll have to see. What's ironic about what you said is the rag joint is the rustiest (visible) part on my entire car.

Appreciate the diagram as well, that's exactly what I need! I always think after I post "I bet the other site has info." Haven't been on that one in a while. I was reading about the guy who wants to make custom wire harnesses for everyone. I was about wetting myself with excitement as I read his plans a while back. Have you ever made any progress with him? If he's legit I'll be needing to become buddies with him in a while.

He is toatl BS like i was thinking. I wanted to post BS in his thread. If he could have built me one from aircraft grade wire for 500 I would have sold something to get the cash. The weight savings alone was cool. Never heard from him again.

Remember to PB Blaster the bolts daily until leading up to unbolting the frame. Also breaker bars with slow even pressure will work better than an impact.

Slow and steady - (like the thread title) that's how I roll. I've been spraying the frame bolts off and on for the past 3 weeks now actually. They should be itchin' to come out now. Just gotta finish a couple little things first then I can get it done.

What a shame about that guy. All that work and effort to sling that BS, to everyone too! I don't get it, why would someone give an email AND phone # to that many people only to vanish? That was my first guess though, unfortunately. "If it sounds too good to be true __________________" That just sucks...

Here's a couple pics of some parts after soaking in the molasses solution. It works beautifully I must say. This is going to save me a ton of time and effort from sanding/wire wheeling all these parts. I was skeptical at first but I'm so glad I made this solution. Just wish I had a container big enough to submerge the subframe in! There's a money making venture in itself for someone who's got a big enough bucket!

Before and After pics:

Those look great, and they didn't eat the skin off of your hands either eh?
So how long did you have them soaking? Did you need to do any brushing or scraping mid-way through the soak cycle?

what goes into that molases soulution??

Appreciate it. You can definitely smell the solution when you take the lid off the container but again, it's cold so it's not bad at all. When it gets to be much warmer I'm sure it'll be pretty pungent. Small price to pay IMO, doesn't smell bad. Normally I would don the use of gloves when working with this stuff but today I was so excited to have my power washwer back in action that I just went in and grabbed the stuff out and went to town spraying the rust off. They were in there just over 3 weeks only because of the washer situation. I never touched the parts with anything but solution and the water today. There's a couple spots on the headlight buckets that I will probably brush (or may even just wipe with my hand) to get the remaining little bit but I didn't have to do anything but wait. If I was more pressed for time I'm sure a brush and a smidge of elbow grease would've expedited the process also. I'm looking forward (for another reason now) to the warmer weather to see how much faster this stuff works. Pretty confident that it doesn't have to be weeks for good results either. I don't have anything that has that much rust luckily.