What motor should I get?
#1
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I'm planning on getting rid of the 86 305 motor my 76 has.
My uncle is selling a 396 for just 400, so I was thinking I could use that. My dad warned me though, if I do that I'll have to swap a lot of parts of the front suspension just to support the motor correctly. I just wanna be sure it's not gonna cost me an arm and a leg. The motor only needs heads, and a crankshaft and is bored out .60 over. If I remember correctly it's from a 1970 Caprice, or something like that. If you guys could help me out I'd really appreciate it. Thanks!
My uncle is selling a 396 for just 400, so I was thinking I could use that. My dad warned me though, if I do that I'll have to swap a lot of parts of the front suspension just to support the motor correctly. I just wanna be sure it's not gonna cost me an arm and a leg. The motor only needs heads, and a crankshaft and is bored out .60 over. If I remember correctly it's from a 1970 Caprice, or something like that. If you guys could help me out I'd really appreciate it. Thanks!
#2
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The 396 is a very good choice, and you don't have to do a bunch (or any) suspension changes, unless you really want to. Yes, it's a bit heavier, but the stock front end will handle the weight. It will set a little lower than stock, but not any lower than many lowered 1976 Camaros do.
The tranny will bolt right up to the engine, and if you use the small block style motor mounts the engine will bolt right in. I would reccommend using some good Moroso solid steel engine mounts for a small block, as a strong 396 will tear the stock engine mounts apart in short time. They're only about $24 a set at Summit Racing.
If your uncle has the factory mounts for the alternator, and power steering pump, that will save you some money too! If not you'll need to go to your local truck wrecking yard and find some from a big block 454 truck. If you buy a water pump be sure to get the long water pump, as it keeps the fan closer to the radiator, and makes brackets and mounting easier.
You'll need to buy a radiator for the big block, which is about 6" widerthan the small block radiator, so you can cut your radiator core support open and buy a new top hold down plate. The bottom is fine, just move the rubber supports to the correct holes. The opening on the support is marked out, so when you get the larger radiator you can test fit it, and remove the metal where it's marked.
The tranny will bolt right up to the engine, and if you use the small block style motor mounts the engine will bolt right in. I would reccommend using some good Moroso solid steel engine mounts for a small block, as a strong 396 will tear the stock engine mounts apart in short time. They're only about $24 a set at Summit Racing.
If your uncle has the factory mounts for the alternator, and power steering pump, that will save you some money too! If not you'll need to go to your local truck wrecking yard and find some from a big block 454 truck. If you buy a water pump be sure to get the long water pump, as it keeps the fan closer to the radiator, and makes brackets and mounting easier.
You'll need to buy a radiator for the big block, which is about 6" widerthan the small block radiator, so you can cut your radiator core support open and buy a new top hold down plate. The bottom is fine, just move the rubber supports to the correct holes. The opening on the support is marked out, so when you get the larger radiator you can test fit it, and remove the metal where it's marked.
#3
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^ I remember you saying practically the exact same thing to someone else just a day or two ago. I think you need to copy & paste that! ![Wink](https://camaroforums.com/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif)
I have one thing to say about the motor mounts though. I wouldn't recommend a solid steel one unless you like getting your fillings jarred loose. I had them on mine, didn't care for them much, and changed over to urethane mounts. Urethane mounts can't separate anyway, they are interlocked internally. Urethane mounts are still noticeably stiffer than rubber, but not as rough as solid steel.
![Wink](https://camaroforums.com/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif)
I have one thing to say about the motor mounts though. I wouldn't recommend a solid steel one unless you like getting your fillings jarred loose. I had them on mine, didn't care for them much, and changed over to urethane mounts. Urethane mounts can't separate anyway, they are interlocked internally. Urethane mounts are still noticeably stiffer than rubber, but not as rough as solid steel.
#4
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Yea, I've thought about putting this reply into my notebook so I don't have to keep typing it over and over! ![Smile](https://camaroforums.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
I'd prefer unrethane also, but darned if I can find a set that fit my Camaro. Tried three different brands, and all had little bends or raised metal parts that didn't match stock, and wouldn't fit my frame mounts. Everything fit the engine side, but not the frame side.
I finally went back to rubber mounts, and did the old rodder trick of installing a chain from my driver's side head to the frame rail. The rubber mounts are also interlocked with safety clips, so they wont move too far, but the rubber will eventually come apart.
![Smile](https://camaroforums.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
I'd prefer unrethane also, but darned if I can find a set that fit my Camaro. Tried three different brands, and all had little bends or raised metal parts that didn't match stock, and wouldn't fit my frame mounts. Everything fit the engine side, but not the frame side.
I finally went back to rubber mounts, and did the old rodder trick of installing a chain from my driver's side head to the frame rail. The rubber mounts are also interlocked with safety clips, so they wont move too far, but the rubber will eventually come apart.
#5
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One thing I noticed someone else who knows (not me for sure!) advised is that you should use the correct BBC engine mounts when you put the engine in. The reason? So that the headers you buy for the conversion will fit without having to to the "chop-chop". The BBC engine mounts set the engine a critical 1" (I think) to the pass. side of the vehicle thus helping headers clear the steering box and the driver's side valve cover clearing the brake master cylinder or booster or both (can't remember which). You'll have to use an appropriate tranny mount as well. I was told to order mounts for a '70-'72 Camaro with a BBC. I'm interested in this because I'm gonna do a SB to BB swap in my '79 Z-28.
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#6
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All that info is bogus. If the engine was somehow staggered 1", or even 1/2" to the left, right, or any direction it would cause other issues. The big block engine will sit correctly with the small block mounts, and I know because I've done 5-6 of these swaps, and always used small block frame and engine mounts.
If the engine was pushed even 1/2" towards the passenger side the valve cover and head would have no clearance with the heater box and it's outlets. There's just enough clearance with stock mounts, and anything less will be big trouble.
If you moved it 1/2" to the driver's side it would then cause the exhaust manifolds or headers to intefere with the steering shaft. There's perfect clearance as is with stock SBC mounts.
Headers might be an issue with any setup, regardless of mounts, but that's a case of header brand, not the type of mounts. My Doug Thorley cheapo headers purchased in 1975 for $49 dropped right in, and clear everything. Pulled the spark plugs and battery cable to install them, then jacked the front end up and dropped them right in from above.
I've also used a set of low end Hedman headers on my friend's 72 with a 454, and they fit great also. Put a set of cheapo Summit brand headers on a 70 and they too fit, but needed a small dent tapped in on the left side to get from zero clearance on the steering shaft to 1/4" clearance. Since the engine pulls away on torque, it gets better with power.
I've read these rumors of staggered mounts, and big block mounts for years, and I wish I knew where it started, because it seems to have snowballed into an urban myth now. Just keeps popping up all over Camaro related forums whenever a topic goes to BBC swaps.
And lastly, there is no difference in trans location, and the trans crossmember doesn't move, so simply bolt the trans to the engine and drive it. No different mount, or location is needed.
PS-You can't use BBC motor mounts on a Camaro with SBC frame mounts. They absolutely will not fit unless you used frame and engine mounts for a BBC Camaro.
If the engine was pushed even 1/2" towards the passenger side the valve cover and head would have no clearance with the heater box and it's outlets. There's just enough clearance with stock mounts, and anything less will be big trouble.
If you moved it 1/2" to the driver's side it would then cause the exhaust manifolds or headers to intefere with the steering shaft. There's perfect clearance as is with stock SBC mounts.
Headers might be an issue with any setup, regardless of mounts, but that's a case of header brand, not the type of mounts. My Doug Thorley cheapo headers purchased in 1975 for $49 dropped right in, and clear everything. Pulled the spark plugs and battery cable to install them, then jacked the front end up and dropped them right in from above.
I've also used a set of low end Hedman headers on my friend's 72 with a 454, and they fit great also. Put a set of cheapo Summit brand headers on a 70 and they too fit, but needed a small dent tapped in on the left side to get from zero clearance on the steering shaft to 1/4" clearance. Since the engine pulls away on torque, it gets better with power.
I've read these rumors of staggered mounts, and big block mounts for years, and I wish I knew where it started, because it seems to have snowballed into an urban myth now. Just keeps popping up all over Camaro related forums whenever a topic goes to BBC swaps.
And lastly, there is no difference in trans location, and the trans crossmember doesn't move, so simply bolt the trans to the engine and drive it. No different mount, or location is needed.
PS-You can't use BBC motor mounts on a Camaro with SBC frame mounts. They absolutely will not fit unless you used frame and engine mounts for a BBC Camaro.
Last edited by 1971BB427; 01-01-2010 at 12:33 PM.
#7
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All that info is bogus. If the engine was somehow staggered 1", or even 1/2" to the left, right, or any direction it would cause other issues. The big block engine will sit correctly with the small block mounts, and I know because I've done 5-6 of these swaps, and always used small block frame and engine mounts.
If the engine was pushed even 1/2" towards the passenger side the valve cover and head would have no clearance with the heater box and it's outlets. There's just enough clearance with stock mounts, and anything less will be big trouble.
If you moved it 1/2" to the driver's side it would then cause the exhaust manifolds or headers to intefere with the steering shaft. There's perfect clearance as is with stock SBC mounts.
I've read these rumors of staggered mounts, and big block mounts for years, and I wish I knew where it started, because it seems to have snowballed into an urban myth now. Just keeps popping up all over Camaro related forums whenever a topic goes to BBC swaps.
And lastly, there is no difference in trans location, and the trans crossmember doesn't move, so simply bolt the trans to the engine and drive it. No different mount, or location is needed.
PS-You can't use BBC motor mounts on a Camaro with SBC frame mounts. They absolutely will not fit unless you used frame and engine mounts for a BBC Camaro.
If the engine was pushed even 1/2" towards the passenger side the valve cover and head would have no clearance with the heater box and it's outlets. There's just enough clearance with stock mounts, and anything less will be big trouble.
If you moved it 1/2" to the driver's side it would then cause the exhaust manifolds or headers to intefere with the steering shaft. There's perfect clearance as is with stock SBC mounts.
I've read these rumors of staggered mounts, and big block mounts for years, and I wish I knew where it started, because it seems to have snowballed into an urban myth now. Just keeps popping up all over Camaro related forums whenever a topic goes to BBC swaps.
And lastly, there is no difference in trans location, and the trans crossmember doesn't move, so simply bolt the trans to the engine and drive it. No different mount, or location is needed.
PS-You can't use BBC motor mounts on a Camaro with SBC frame mounts. They absolutely will not fit unless you used frame and engine mounts for a BBC Camaro.
#8
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I guess my terminology shouldn't have been "bogus", as it may be true for a factory install, but it's sure not needed to do the swap. Why change all that over to do a swap that is even easier and cheaper to do without all that expense and time?
I suppose if one wants to try and pass it off as a factory installation, then it would be necessary, but it's sure not needed to complete a swap.
I suppose if one wants to try and pass it off as a factory installation, then it would be necessary, but it's sure not needed to complete a swap.
#9
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Right, and in my case (small block with tall valve covers), I just took the heater core out altogether. The fittings were in the way, and it's a fair weather (no heater) car anyway.
#10
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I tried that for awhile when my core went bad. I just couldn't live without heat for long. We get some nice clear days during the wineter, and a couple times I took the Camaro out I nearly froze with the core bypassed.
Besides I only have one fun ride, so I can't switch to another with heat on cold days!
Besides I only have one fun ride, so I can't switch to another with heat on cold days!
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