Hi all,
First off, please don't just respond and tell me to search. Half of the point of posting my questions is to start building relationships with people here on the forum. I'll search (here and elsewhere) for answers, but having a conversation can yield so much more detailed information.

OK, down to nuts and bolts. I'm getting ready to sell off my Corvair powered '70 VW bus... (don't hate, It's awesome! And a few people are interested so it should be gone pretty quick), and eyeing a first gen camaro that I've seen sitting in the back lot of a local business for the last dozen years or more. It appears complete, has glass/engine/interior that are serviceable but very crusty looking. No apparent rust or body damage.... A little bird recently told me the owner is willing to part with it since he never got around to restoring it (his intent at the time of purchase). I always liked early muscle cars but grew up in the VW world so my depth of knowledge isn't as deep as I'd like it to be when looking for projects. Hence the questions.

Most important, what's the current base value range for a complete, crusty first gen camaro? Let's start with the assumption that it's a nothing special model without the original engine, no major rust, and in need of soft parts (rubber components, fuel and brake system, etc) due to long storage.

Second, what are the things I should look for or at before buying? I mean both good and bad here. What are the value adders (option packages like the ss etc, specific drive train or interior options, etc) and what are the pitfalls (wear or rust areas, mechanical issues, missing parts that can't be found, etc). I can investigate for wrecks and repairs easily enough, but if I can home in on the Camaro specific trouble areas or value adders it would help me make a good purchase.

Finally, my immediate intent would just be to get the thing running and roll it as is (Patina/survivor cars are a big thing in the VW world, and rolling that way for a while gives me time to decide what direction to go), but I'll eventually need to decide on what to do when it comes to building the car... Are there any guidelines you guys might suggest as far as which cars to keep original and which might be good candidates for custom touches? I never build anything wild in terms of cosmetics, but performance mods are always something I focus on....

Anything you can contribute that you think might be helpful would be welcome. I'm on a learning curve here and not just "looking for the answer that I want to hear".

Thanks all

 

The rust prone areae are the complete rear quarter panels, rocker panels, rear lower front fenders, base of the windshield/dash top, base of the rear window, floors, trunk, doors at the pinch seam, rear frame rails at the shackles and at the upper shock mounts. Basically, most of the body, so go over the entire car with a fine tooth comb. Some of the rust issues can be hidden, also some could have been covered up by a previous owner. If it has rust in all those areas, you're looking at a costly restore if you can't do the work yourself. Hard to say without seeing what this one is worth, it could be a $1,000 parts car if it's rusted out but there's still stuff of value on it. The guy really didn't do it any favors letting it sit outside all these years, so I'd expect to have rust in hidden places.
Since you're new to the Camaro world, post some pictures of the car, and post other info such as the numbers on the engine block in front of the passenger side head, the VIN, and a picture of the trim tag on the firewall. All that will help to better value the thing.

 

Thanks for the response.
I failed to mention that I live in AZ. Even rust prone cars survive very well out here. I'm really not that worried about it being a rust bucket, but want to check the biggest trouble areas just in case.

I'm really not trying to be difficult, but I'm not planning to approach the owner until I'm good and ready. I have it on good authority that he's given up any plans to do anything with the car and has no emotional attachment to it. No need to get him thinking about selling while I'm still trying to figure out what it's worth, or before I make room in my garage. So that means no photos right now unless you want me to take a few "across the fence" shots, which probably won't tell you anything but the color. That's why I tossed all those assumptions out there. I was hoping just to get a general idea of the range that complete but crusty cars are going for right now and not looking for an estimate on this particular car. I know that even with photos that would be impossible.

I've been combing everything from the local classifieds to Barrett Jackson sales figures to get an idea of values but there just aren't many complete/unrestored cars around to compare to.... I'm hoping the community here are the ones who have searched those out. At the very least, maybe sharing what you paid and what the car needed would be a good starting point.

For what it's worth, I'm surprised at the prices for restored cars. Seems like except for the special cars, they've dropped a little bit since the last time I attended a classic car auction (maybe 9-10 years ago).
Thanks again.

 

One thing about project cars is they are very subject to area. In my area A low/no rust straight rolling shell in 67 or 68 with a clean title is going to sell for 6-7K, A 69 maybe 7-8K. Here almost everything you go to look at has rust issue. These cars where designed to last 6-8 years. A great many 1st gens where scrapped out in the late 70s and 80s due to rust issue that were not worth fixing.

Now that is just a shell that would need leveled fine adjustment and painted. It may need a complete interior and would need a complete driveline.

If there is anything special about the car it could go up in value fast. I don't just mean RS or SS packages. It could have the high output 327 with the 4 speed and the above prices just doubled.

On the other side is if the rust free car has been hacked for large tires or frame connectors the price would drop pretty quick.

I have no way of knowing what they sell for in your area but the internet has leveled the playing field some. Use to be you take car carrier to the south and bring back 5 shells and make good money for 3-4 days of work. But with ebay and so many shipping companies it can be tuff to make any real profit anymore.

Don't be suprised if the owner hits you will a big asking price. In 2006 that body was selling 10-12K. Some people remember those times and don't like to admit something they owned went down in value. At least he did not buy it during that time. The price at that time was so crazy that dynacorn started making a replacment body.

 

You also have subjective value.. How much your willing to pay, how much he is willing to ask, and finally since you have no idea what he wants sticker shock and how many other people have seen and asked him to sell it. Waiting is not your friend in this case and making a deal as soon as possible is.. So how much is it worth really,,,, Exactly how much your willing to pay and at that point you say not another dime, then you have the value.. Problem for you is he may have another guy 1k more than your willing to pay by the time you get around to it. Figure it is going to need comfortably worth 30 thousand to get it nice and on the road again.. how much are you willing to pay above that to buy a project you can not drive for a year or so... ? Average price in my area, rusted shells 8-9k Convertible shell 15k and a running car that still needs work 15k.... For sale running cars in my area in great shape start about 30k and numbers matching and other variables can press the number to 50 to 60k very quickly... Top end cars fetch over 100k if if if....

 

I would point out that just because you live in AZ and the car is located there now does not mean it spent it's entire life there. These cars are approaching 50 years old soon and they have been everywhere over their lifetimes. Additionally, these cars had no rust protection inside body cavities from the factory in fact they were not even painted in some areas so rust is common. You MUST check for rust!!!

 

Hey thanks for all the input guys. Luckily the car isn't being actively advertised for sale and it's not easily visible. It's probably relatively safe for the moment but I'll take the time advice in mind. Ditto for the rust. It's not like vehicles don't rust here, but the instances of finding cars that have extensive rust and not just isolated spots is much lower than in some of the northern or eastern states. I'm used to seeing old C10 pickups (I'm also a truck guy) with the rear corners of the front fenders rusted out.

$30K to get it nice? Really? I know people spend that much and more, but for something you're just going to drive? I've given up on building show cars. I can do all the work myself. I've done paint/body (even rust repair and metal finishing), interior, electrical, and drivetrain work and won't be farming anything out. I'm patient and I can usually match professional results as long as I'm not pressed for time. So really it's just the cost of parts and icy hot to ease the sore muscles at the end of the day that I have to deal with. As long as everything is there to begin with, I'm sure I can beat that number by a country mile

 

your going to be shocked how many parts your going to need and then all those little parts and screws are going to add up fast.. I assume nothing is salvageable and if you get to keep a few things all the better.. But yea 30k or at least close is a safe bet. I also assume your not going to build a piece of junk with that price. You can do it for less cut costs get used get cheaper products but I already figure a guy on here is a car guy and not going to get cheap stuff but the best. All I can say for sure is it adds up fast, I have 3 inches of paper work currently for repairs to a running car and can tell you I have not added up the bills yet, I am afraid to and my wife finds out what all those parts cost.. I have two numbers, the one I tell my wife and the truth... My biggest fear is I die and she sells the car based on the number I tell her..

 

[QUOTE= I have two numbers, the one I tell my wife and the truth... My biggest fear is I die and she sells the car based on the number I tell her..[/QUOTE]

Ain't that the truth.....


I probably spent too much on a finished 68 convertable but when you add up what it would cost to finish one of these out you could easily hit $100k unless you can do all the body and paint work yourself or have a really good friend that's skilled and does it cheap.

I added up a stack of receipts for kick knac crap I bought in the past year. It was over $5k.

 

How much you want to spend on a restoration is up you. What a car needs is relative. You can clean out the gas tank run your own hand made fuel and brake lines patch and rust holes, rebuild the existing brakes through a LM7 (5.3) out of a 01 suburban and be going down the road strong for under 2k plus the price of the car. Heck you don't even have to paint it unless you want too. Primer works and you can through on some plastic dip to protect it.

If your feeling rich you can put a china made turbo on your junk yard motor and hit 500 hp no problem. At 500 ponies the transmission and rear are going to have a very limited life but it would be a fun 15 minutes.

Or you can spend 50k returning every detail back to near perfect and be scared to park anywhere unattended. The nice part of the Rat rod concept is as long as you do not cut the car up and you do all the sheet metal repair well enough that you protect the original parts from further damage you can always change your mind and do a restoration later. Once you have a "restored" car you become its keeper not its owner.